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Понеже скоро отново говорихме за проблемите с превода ( а и покрай "Джайлс") се сетих за тази статия за проблемите на руските преводачи... Strider било БРОДЯЖНИК :)))
A few interesting translations from the Lord of the Rings are: "What's this? A ranger caught off his guard?" (in Russian: "Aren't you looking for the wrong footprints?"); "Great, now where are we going?" (in Russian: "When do we start?"). When Merry is swept off the ground to be plopped practically in Eowyn's lap and grins with very male pleasure and says, "My Lady!" the Russian translation is actually "My mistress!". That one got some major laughter in Ukrainian theaters. The name Worm-tongue in Russian is Gnil-oost, which means "Rotten Lips"; and Strider in the movie is Strannik, which means "Wanderer," and in the book it is Brodyazhnik, which means "Tramp".
The titles of the first two movies are in themselves interesting translations. Fellowship of the Ring is translated as "Bratstvo Koltsa" which literally means "Brotherhood of the Ring" and The Two Towers is translated as "Dve Kreposti", meaning "The Two Fortresses". So the ideas were certainly not lost, but just slightly changed. At the moment there are about 5 different translations of the books and each one that I've seen seems to have a different translation of the titles (I've seen 3). Olya, who has seen all five, said: "I've noticed that one translator kept all English names of characters, another tried to come up with the Russian equivalents, and the third one used the name Babbins instead of Baggins for some strange reason."
Германците също имат проблеми - цитирам дословно :
would be really interessted in how they made the translations of the books. I just can talk here about the german and english version by comparison. A few examples.
Shelob is called "Kankra" in german
The Shire is called "Auenland" in german (which means not really the same!)
Rivendell means "Bruchtal" and so on...
The biggest confusion which came up when I discussed, were the "Elves", because the word "Elf" makes you think of a faery in german, because it just means that. That's why they call the LOTR Elves "Elben" in german.
Финландците :
As for your examples, Shelob is called Lukitari, which is an old-fashioned word meaning a female spider, and the Shire translates as Kontu, an old word for "homeland" or "native place". Rivendell is an exception - it has been left as it is in the original language, because there simply is no good translation for it; another exception is Dunharrow, of which the Old English form Dunharg is used. With the Elves, there was no problem, because the words for "elf" and "faery" are different
Испански :
have heard Tolkien knew spanish language and helped in some translation:
Elves: Elfos
Wormtoungue: Grima (means disgust in english) Lengua de Serpiente
Shadowfax: Sombragris
Shelob: Ella-Laraba
The Shire:La Comarca
Frodo/Bilbo Baggins: F/B Bolsen
Rivendell: Rivendel
Strider: Trancos
Samwise: Samsagaz
Lord of the rings: El senor de los anillos
The felowship of the ring: la compania del anillo
The two towers: Las dos torres
The return of the king: El retorno del rey
Frodo Baggins: Frodo Bolsen
Samwise Gamgee: Samsagaz Gamyi
Merry/meriadoc Brandybuck: Merry/Meriadoc Brandigamo
Pippin/Peregrin Took: Pippin/peregrin Tuk
Strider:trancos
Shadowfax: Sombragros
Grima Wormtongue: Grima Lengua de Serpiente (this means snake tongue,even worse )
Legolas Greenleaf: Legolas hojaverde
Treebeard: Borbol
Entwives: Ent-mujeres
Mirkwood: Bosque negro
Rivendell: Rivendel
Misty mountains: Montanas nubladas
Wheather top: Cima de los vientos
Helm's Deep: Abismo de Helm
Хърватски:
In the Croatian version (the only one except the English one I read) almost all the names are the same, except the ones that really obviously mean something, like Greenleaf,Misty Mountains or Wormtongue (and they are all translated surprisingly accurately) . All other names like Shire, Shelob,Rivendell or Strider have been kept, with only a minor alternation here and there to make the names have more sense for Croatian readers (eg. Shelob=Sheloba, Gollum=Golum).
Lotr= Gospodar Prstenova
Mirkwood= Mrkodol (means something like dark wood/dale )
Legolas Greenleaf= Legolas Zelenlist
Helm`s Deep= Helmova Klisura
Elf/Elves= Vilenjak/Vilenjaci
Grima Wormtongue= Grima Gujoslov (snake-speech)
Witch-king= Kralj-vjeshtac
Old Man Willow= Vrbov-starac
An interesting thing for me is that some names that have been kept the same as in the original mean something different in Croatian... for example, Snaga, the name for lesser Orcs, means slaves in Black Speech, but strength or power in Croatian. That had me quite confused for a while because I didn`t know whether the name had been translated or not...
Холандия:
Gollum is Gollem
Merry is Merijn
Pippin is Pipijn.
Helms Deep is Helms Diep
Misty Mountians is Mistbergen
Mirkwood is Demsterwold
Brandywine - Brandewijn
Buckland - Bokland
Shire - Gouw (which is a bad translation in my opinion)
Weathertop - Weertop
Old Forrest - Oude Woud
Полски :
LOTR - Wladca Pierscieni
Elves - Elfy
Eowyn and Arwen - Eowina and Arwena
Mirkwood - Mroczna Puszcza
Helm's Deep - Helmowy Jar
These are all pretty accurate, but wait for this. Since LOTR was always very popular in Poland, it has been translated more than one time by different people (three that I can think of, but probably more). And that's when the real war started! People still fight (and I mean FIGHT) over who translated it better. Majority (including myself) support the first and the most accurate translation (where most of the names are kept the same, and the ones translated really represent the meaning).
But THIS ONE GUY made a HORRIBLE job of translating LOTR. Accoridng to him:
Stryder = Lazik-which basically means Little Walker (go figure)
Old Man Willow - well, let's put it the way it is - he made him a FEMALE!
This all can bring a bit of confusion. For example if you talk about Gandalf's horse you either call him Shadowfax or Gryf OR Szarogrzywy...
Унгарски
the Shire = Megye (accurate)
Elf = tunde (this is a specially made-up word but it comes from the word for fairy)
Dwarf = torp (also special for dwarf)
Strider = Vandor (this means wanderer)
Merry = Trufa (comes from the word for lark or joke)
Shadowfax = Keselyustok
Shelob = Banyapok (=witch-spider, and that she is...)
Rivendell = Volgyzugoly (also a made-up word, a dale that is a nice place for seclusion, to hide and be at home in)
"Goruk Ura" means Lord of the Rings and
"Ket Torony" The two towers in hungarian
From Italian, I remember
Pippin= Pipino
Strider= Grampasso
Руски и китайски:
In Russian Mirkwood is "Глухой Лес / Glookhoy Lyes", which means thick, dense, wild or remote, out-of-the-way (literally "deaf") forest, which is different again. Elves and dwarves are “елфы / elfiy” and “гномы / gnomiy”, which aren’t really Slavic terms but instead are borrowed from the English terms “elves” and “gnomes”.
Like the other European languages, Russian translates the underlying elements of the Westron names represented by English into approximate Russian equivalents. So Misty Mountains becomes "Мгистые Горы / Mgleestiye Goriy" or "Hazy Mountains". Rivendell is "Раздол / Razdol", which translates as something like "separated valley". Names in Sindarin, Quenya and other languages remain in their original forms, transliterated in the cyrillic alphabet.
Two words about Russian translation. There are more then four different translations. The first one (it was made in 1980s) is "free", almost all names are translated and sometimes they changed out of all recognition. For example Gildor becomes Garald, Glorfingel - Vseslavur (from word slava- glory) Here are some names for your collection:
Frodo/Bilbo Baggins - Frodo/Bilbo Torbins (torba - old russion for bag)
Bag-end - Torba-na-Kruche (bag upon hill)
Shire - Hobbitania
Hobbiton - Norgord (nora - hole)
Rohan - Ristania (dont know what it is supposed to mean)
Brandywine - Brendiduim (we drink brandy)
Meriadock Brandybuck - M. Brendizaik
Peregrin Took - P. Krol (rabbit)
Gollum - Gorlum
Samwise Gamgee - Semium Skrombi
In Chinese elves are “jingling” which translates as “fairy, sprite or elf” implying quick, clever beings of strong spirit or essence. Dwarves are just “airen” or “short people”. Chinese seems to transliterate almost all proper names, except for the really obvious ones, into the best representations of the English sounds it can manage. So while Misty Mountains is "Wu Shun", the "Mist Mountains", Mirkwood becomes "“Mijiahuote” (Mee-jia-hwo-tuh) which is meaningless, literally "rice/add/live/special". Likewise, Rivendell is "Ruivendai-er” (Ray-wuhn-dai-ar) or "lucky/culture/wear". Then there's Elrond: "Ailangde;" (Ai-lahng-duh) or "mugwort/bridegroom/virtue". And Legolas: "Laigelasi" (Lai-guh-la-suh) or "radish/partition/pull/this".
At least Galadriel's name "Kailancui-er" (Kai-lan-tsway-ar) translates into Chinese as the more dignified "triumphant/orchid/lofty".
Frodo Baggins-Fodo Baican.(Foh-Doh By-kan).
Bilbo Baggins-Bibu Baican.(Bee-Boo By-Kan).
Gollum-Golu.(Goh-Loo).
Pippin Took-Pipang Te(Pee-Pang Tuh).
Merry-Mali Pandice(Mah-lee Pan-dee-kuh).
Gandalf-Gandaofu(Gan-daow-foo).
Boromir-Baimi(By-mee).
Faramir-Falimo(Fah-lee-moh).
Ailoan(Yl-Wahn)-Elrond.
Aioan(Y-wahn)-Arwen.
Ligasu(Lee-Gah-Soo)-Legolas.
Giangli(Gyahng-lee)-Gimli.
Shuaoluman(Shoo-aow-loo-man)-Sauruman.
Usu(OO-Soo)-Orc(s).
Hobwo(Hob-Woh)-hobit
Датски:
Samwise Gamgee=Samvis Gammegod
Frodo/Bilbo Baggins=Frodo/Bilbo Sokker
The Shire=Herredet
Hobbiton=Hobbitrup
Mirkwood=Dysterskoven
Strider=Traver
Rivendell=Kløvedal
Brandywine River=Brandevinsfloden
Bree=Bri
Sackville-Baggins=Posenborg-Sokker
Peregrin Took-Peregrin Toker
Meriadoc Brandybuck-Meriadoc Brandebuk
Arwen=Arven
Bill=Jens
Gandalf the White/Grey=Gandalf den Hvide/Gra;
Elves=Elver
Hobbits=Hobitter
English- Dutch- Norwegian
Strider- Stapper- Vidvandre
Gollum- Gollem- Gollum
Mirkwood- Demsterwold- Myrkskog
Rivendell- Rivendel- Klovendal
Samwise Gamgee- Sam Gewissies- Samvis Gammegod
Baggins- Balings- Lommelun
Misty Mountains- Nevelbergen -Takefjellene
Bree- Breeg- Bri
Mount Doom- Doemberg- Dommedags Berg
The Shire- De Gouw- Hobbittun (I think)
Bag End- Balingshoek-Lommekroken
Исландски:
Middle Earth = Mitgardur
Shire = Herad; (means the same)
Frodo Baggins = Frodi Baggi
Samwise Gamgee = Sami Gamban
Meriadoc Brandybuck = Karadukur Brunbukkur (which sounds ridiculous, he he)
Peregrin Took = Forungur Toki ("Forungur" has a somewhat similar meaning to "peregrin" but still sounds ridiculous imo)
Merry = Katur (meaning "merry", and funnily enough, this is a name which is quite often used for dogs in my country, so it always makes me laugh)
Pippin = Pipinn (it's an old Icelandic translation of the old (I think) French name Pippin)
Rivendell = Rofadalur (not a translation but sounds similar)
Misty Mountains = Pokufjoll (direct transl.)
Mirkwood = Myrkvidur (direct transl.)
Brandywine = Branavin (literally, brown-wine)
Strider = Stigur (meaning basically the same thing)
Gollum = Gollrir
Smeagol =Smjagall
Shelob = Skella
(Those last three names are not translations, but just Icelandic-like terms that sound similar)
Now moving unto Rohan. Now, since Icelandic and Old English are very related languages, the Rohirrim names are all translated into equivalent Icelandic terms.
Theoden = Tjodan (an old Norse word, meaning "king)
Theodred = Tjodradur
Eomer = Jomar
Eowyn = Jоvin
(In Icelandic we have the old word "jоr", meaning "horse", which is the same word as the Old English word "Еoh")
Grиma Wormtongue = Grimur Ormstunga (direct transl.)
Isengard = Isarngerdi (meaning something like "iron garden", "isarn" being an old Norse word for iron)
The Gondorian names and the Elvish names aren't changed, but the spelling is sometimes a bit different, like: Minas Tirith = Minas Tirid, and some other names. - However, the translator does one HUGE mistake about the Elvish names starting with a C. He writes them Seleborn, Selebrian and Sirdan... which is absolutely wrong! It should really be Keleborn etc. (we don't have C in Icelandic).
Having said this, I'm still very pleased over the Icelandic translation. Jorsteinn Thorarensen, who did the translation work, did imo a very good job, and he managed to translate the book into somewhat old-fashioned, almost 19th century Icelandic, which sounds very nice and Tolkien-like.
Oh, and I forgot: The Icelandic word for "elf" is "alfur", which can mean any kind of elf/fairy... from a strong Tolkien-like elf to a tiny little pixie. - Dwarf is "dvergur", meaning any kind of dwarf. For instance, we use that word for midgets as well. - Orc is translated "orki" pl. "orkar". Hobbit is just "hobbiti" pl. "hobbitar".
Шведски:
Frodo Baggins = Frodo Bagger (old translation)/ Frodo Secker (new translation)
Meriadoc Brandybuck = Meriadoc Vinbock
Brandywine = Vinbocks floden
Sackville-Baggins = Sacksta-Baggers
Hobbington = Hobsala (old) / Hobbinge (new)
Shire = Fylke
Samwise Gamgee = Samuel Gamgi (old)
Hobbit = Hob (old)
Rivendell = Rivendell (old Bilbo translation) / Vattnadal (old) / Klyfte Dal (new)
Helms Deep = Helms Klyfta
The Black Gates = Svarta Porten
Shelob = Honmonstret
Elves = Alver
Treebeard = Lavskagge
Lord of The Rings: Fellowship of the Ring = Sagan Om Ringen : Sagan Om Ringen
Lord of The Rings: The Two Towers: Sagan Om Ringen: De Tva Tornen
Lord of The Rings: The Return of the King: Sagan Om Ringen: Konungens Aterkomst
Редактирано от MANlMAL на 07.02.05 17:20.
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Lost in translation...
